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    Testing the TAC 15

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    Basilisk120
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    Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Basilisk120 on Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:00 pm

    Hey all, I got to test out the TAC 15 at the PSE pro-shop today. The things is a beast, but it a good way. I didn't get to shoot too much as I was just testing it out but I did talk to the one of the guys at PSE who has spent some time with it.

    First thing that I noticed is that it is fairly heavy but not as bad as I first thought it would be. But getting the bipod or shooting sticks would be a good thing.

    Shooting the TAC 15 is an interesting experience. With so much stored energy the limbs the TAC-15 has a noticeable kick almost as much as the AR15 only with out the sproing sound. Razz (for those not familiar with AR 15 it has a spring recoil compensator in the stock that makes a sproing sound when the gun is fired)
    At 20 yards the TAC 15 is good, the bolts were less than a 1/4" apart and I wasn't even really trying for accuracy. But the TAC 15 doesn't really shine till the ranges get longer and the TAC 15 really shines at LONG range. The TAC 15 is capable of MOA accuracy at 100 yards Shocked and acceptable accuracy at 120 yards. The TAC 15 is capable of being more accurate at 100 yard than some rifles I have.

    After trying it out I see why it has to use the special bolts. The bolts for the TAC 15 are long and heavier than I expected but they have double thick carbon walls to make them stiff enough for the bow.

    Ok that's about it for now.



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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Tue Dec 21, 2010 2:46 am

    I am a bit jealous, that bow does look like a beast and must be wicked(heavy drunken ) fun to shoot. Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
    ...I believe Wyvern on AT forum posted a few pics of actually shooting
    this bow comfortably off hand with the help of a pivoting shooting stick
    (shooting buddy?) rested against his belt buckle/stomach.

    Not a
    new question, but still wondering - How much of it's energy is a bolt
    going to keep at 100-120 yards? I mean it will obviously lose some of
    it's punch as it travels towards the target.

    Medival longbow archers used some seriously heavy arrows, around 100
    grams if I'm not mistaken, to be effective at those distances, so how
    much does a TAC arrow weight? 425-427 grains is around 30 grams...I'm missing something...better go sleep on it. Sleep




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    Basilisk120
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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Basilisk120 on Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:09 am

    I would believe that would have significant energy at 100 yards. The bolts are about 24 to 26 inches long (didn't have a tape measure to get an exact measurment) and as you mentioned weight 425 grains which felt about 50 to 100 grains heavier than an arrow of the same lenght. What you may have been overlooking Ivo is that the TAC 15's power stroke is easily twice as long as a medival crossbow and approaching that of a compound's power stroke.

    At 20 yards those bolts were burried to the fletching in to the target. For reference arrows from my compound only go in about half way or so (12 to 14 inches).

    Just for reference: From the PSE web site the TAC 15 speed is about 410 fps and has between 152 to 160 FT-lbs of kinetic energy in the bolts. Which is roughly about 50 fps faster and 45 ft-lbs more energy than the fastest compound from PSE.

    So it should have enough energy at 100 yard to take a deer. I might limit my shots to 80 yards like I do with my compound but that is more me than the equipment.

    One last thing, this wouldn't be complete with out mentioning the cranking mechanism. The crank works well in that it is smooth and relativly easy to turn, there is definatly resitance but not so much that I worked up a sweat cranking it. While it is handy to use the crank can be the biggest weakness of the TAC 15 as well. There is a ratcheting mechanism that keeps the crank from unwinding while it is being spanned but if the lever is knocked up during spanning or more likely if a hunter wants to unspan the TAC 15 and doesn't have a good grip on the crank when they unlock the mechanism it can lead to a dry fire which is bad. Apperently several have been brought back for repair after being dry fired during unspanning.



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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Wed Dec 22, 2010 3:14 pm

    That crank has been on my mind for a long time now...my hands itch to climb under the hood...I'm already picturing some unique gear assembly.

    I kinda neglected my research of these new models with all the work I had and trying to press a set of fiberglass limbs, but dug in and struck gold...some very interesting information in this review I found on AT. The article is about the TAC 15i, a one piece TAC15 that does not require an AR15 lower to function. >>> PSE TAC 15i Crossbow Report

    Things like the rail-less system being one of the points that fascinated me was one of the many things explained.

    I had suspected that a rail-less design had it's advantages, but couldn't put a finger on it without a highspeed camera cyclops , a word on it in the article brought me a bit closer to seeing what was it all about. Considering the TAC arrows are looooong and the famous archers paradox is inevitable, a rail-less system targets that very aspect allowing the arrow to flex without any interference...as opposed to a crossbow employing an arrow rail where interference due to friction is inevitable. I guess the advantages of one system over the other are are debatable considering the wear of the whisker-biscuit that would require some tuning in the future, as opposed to the solid hard anodized rail. The ability to tune ones rest is an inovation not available on any other crossbow on the market so far, but still wondering if there will be products available to address the issue of arrows slowly eating away that biscuit. jocolor

    All in all TAC is wicked sick in practically all aspects, but one(whisker-biscuit aside) ...and it's "cams"

    The performance is damn good with a hard cam system on it...


    but binary cams would throw an additional "+" to balancing this already fast and accurate combo.




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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by jake-owa on Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:21 pm

    If trajectory is relatively flat at 100 yards it has PLENTY of energy at that range.
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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Fri Dec 24, 2010 9:51 am

    Yes I see now, that crossbow really is a beast of modern crossbows. biggy

    Unfortunately the original TAC 15 will only be alowed to hunt with during the firearm season. If I have my info right, simply the presence of AR 15 in this assembly technically classifies TAC 15 as a firearm...thus the appearance of TAC 15i/10i on the market.

    Just a small note, considering one is most likely checking out that bow to one day take it on a hunt. Smile


    Last edited by Ivo on Fri Dec 24, 2010 9:55 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : IPhone was not built for surfing forums. :))




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    Whisker biscuits

    Post by Moon on Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:20 pm

    are great for vertical compound hunting bows because the arrow cannot be knocked off the rest in hunting conditions. I used them for 3 years. It was a love/hate deal. They wear out quickly and react differently between hot and cold weather, not to mention being very hard on vanes......even on 60 lb draw vertical bows. Just think how those negatives will be even more pronounced on a 175 lb crossbow
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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Basilisk120 on Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:40 pm

    Ivo, Well around here the fact the TAC 15 is on a AR lower doesn't effect anything but all crossbows can only be used in rifle (or H.A.M) seasons so its not that much of a change. I think the TAC 15i/10i were made for people who didn't want (or couldn't) buy an AR lower.



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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Tue Dec 28, 2010 4:22 am

    Well that makes things a whole lot simpler...good for you. Smile

    Gotta tell you, for these past few days Ive been thinking about this whole modular concept. I'm not big on firearms, but the idea of fitting a crossbow and a rifle into a single case is simply fantastic! Say...build a trigger/rail/prod module (perhaps something shorter with reverse draw and a lever lock side mount scope) to fit on an existing lower, but here's a question...are there any other firearms that break down to upper and lower like an AR15, but perhaps of a lower profile?




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    The wheels are turning

    Post by Moon on Tue Dec 28, 2010 9:06 am

    cheers
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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:24 am

    I have a quick question regarding the arrows...or the fletching to be exact...

    Is the fletching helical or parallel to the shaft? And this might be a long shot, but what angle is the fletching set at?

    I'll ask around, but if you guys know, let me know too. Wink




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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Basilisk120 on Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:42 am

    They are straight fletched with short (3 inch?) vanes. I would guess they have a 1° or 2° angle. Next time I'm at PSE I'll see if I can get a better look and a good picture.

    As for modular rifles. Most of the modular rifles I have seen are variations on the AR theme with a few exceptions. The Thompson/Center G2 Contender: http://www.tcarms.com/firearms/g2ContenderCenterfire.php
    and the Blaser R 93: http://www.blaser-usa.com/Rifles.43.0.html
    Blaser is a German Rifle company that specialises in Modular rifles for the European market hence not well known in the US. Basically buy one rifle and it can be converted to almost any other with a quick barrel and slide change.

    The more I thought about using the Blaser or G2 as a base the more I liked the project. Something a little more classic looking the the TAC 15



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    Re: Testing the TAC 15

    Post by Ivo on Tue Jan 18, 2011 6:06 pm

    Thanks Basilisk,

    Those are some sweet looking guns, that would definitely make a classy looking bow...I feel the new age of crossbows creeping up on us.

    Also...I just got a message from a TAC15 dealer and found out that the fletching is set 180 degrees apart and can be fletched straight. I got this little project inspired by a few builds I've seen, I'll post a design discussion a bit later once I have everything drawn up...I have so much on my mind...
    wonder if I'm walking around with a hacksaw and file in my sleep yet. Razz Razz Razz




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