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    Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

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    Kale Schlegel
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    Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Kale Schlegel on Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:15 pm

    OK.. Been thinking of drawing plans for a compact survival crossbow , as the topic title has already implied. I'll delve deeper into it once i draw some plans up later. I can see this project being extremely complicated to process , as it has to fold down to a very compact size. For an example here's the Magpul PTS..

    Hope that works, if not Google or Bing it ,hah. More to come soon ... scratch

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    Todd the archer
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Todd the archer on Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:15 am

    For crossbows the Barnett Delta Storm would be the standard to compare with.



    Here it is in a case next to 20" arrows



    uncased



    set up



    Ready to shoot.



    Shoots a 450 grain arrow at 200 fps, enough to hunt with.



    Todd

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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Guest on Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:22 am

    gone


    Last edited by Gui on Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    kenh
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by kenh on Fri Aug 17, 2012 6:20 am

    What part or parts do you want to "compact" Kale? If it's just the stock, then adding a detachable or extendable shoulder stock of some sort to a pistol (and here a pistol bow) is an old technique, as is folding the stock sideways for storage. Compacting the prod by folding, or cams or whatever is another thing entirely.

    You need to establish some design criteria - draw weight and folded dimensions for starters.

    Also method of conversion from compact to full size -- unfold, extend, assemble separate pieces or some combination thereof? My pistol bow with the prod detached and laid alongside the stock is pretty darn compact, and its 80 lb draw will kill anything I need to in a survival situation. Adding an extension to make a shoulder stock would be a snap. But it will take 15 minutes to assemble to use. Is that acceptable? Or do you want to go from compact to firing in under a minute for example?

    I would think that a pistol sized prod with perhaps heavier draw weight, would be a good place to start. Then design a stock that folds and or extends to fuller dimensions.

    Love the Barnett Delta Storm, BTW...
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    Kale Schlegel
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Kale Schlegel on Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:12 am

    Well,I've been watching the Backyard Bowyer and I've seen Joerg Sprave hass done it as well,compact 3 piece arrows. I figure a few on a small integral hollowed out portion, kinda like how an AR7 fits in, or more-so like a gun cleaning kit portion but with disassembled arrows. Not 100% sure if they could withstand the constant force of being shot. The limb system is ingenious with the delta storm x-bow , however I wanted to make the crossbow internally powered with one or two compression springs, or since its my first build maybe something less complicated. Such as folding limbs but reverse draw such as a Horton Vision 175. Has anyone cut those generic crossbow limbs in half ? Haven't drawn any plans yet so I'm not sure what I want to, fold, but i was thinking the limbs the stock folding downward and the grip being able to swing and lock into place. I'm downright incompetent when trying to think of locking mechanisms. Can anyone chime in with a good detail or better yet , picture ?

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    kenh
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by kenh on Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:11 pm

    Bolts are one place where crossbows, compared to longbows, don't really need compacting. Multi-piece arrows seem to me to be a skewered hand waiting to happen. Storing bolts in a hollowed stock is great idea.

    Grip? You mean a 'pistol grip'? Can't see where having that articulated will save any space.

    IMHO if it doesn't have a prod (bow) crossing a staff/stock, it's not a cross-bow. Joerg and other make some interesting torsion or rubber powered weapons, but to this olde farte they don't qualify as cross-bows. Nice weapons, granted, but not cross-bows. If you're going to all that mechanical building hassle, just use compressed air or gunpowder
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    Kale Schlegel
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Kale Schlegel on Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:43 pm

    I'd like to think of it as more of as you stated , a.... well it wouldn't necessarily be torsion assisted, partly because the torsion springs needed to generate decent power are too big or too hard to find. Not sure if you've ever seen this video but it inspired me to start drawing up designs.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=he6zA5MTMuo&feature=plcp
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    Gnome
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Gnome on Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:11 pm

    Kale, I was thinnking about compressed air to power crossbow type projectiles, and wondered if anyone ever used compressed air or C02 by storing the gas inside the aluminum body of an arrow shaft. It would work like a cartridge system, could be made to feed from a magazine pretty easy, I'd think.

    kenh, I agree with your definition of crossbow, though it's obvious that many members of the forum are fans of all kinds of esoteric and inventive weaponry.

    Todd, that Barnett Delta Storm looks sweet!
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    Todd the archer
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Todd the archer on Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:38 pm

    The Barnett Delta Storm has discontinued for years. There are some Chinese made crossbows that are simular but ironically they are not copies of the Barnett design.



    I bought mine used on Craig's List.



    You can buy the limbs for the folding style. I'll see if I can find the website.



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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Todd the archer on Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:48 pm

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    Kale Schlegel
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Kale Schlegel on Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:45 pm

    Gnome , have you seen the airrow system? uses compressed air. I've also seen ruger 10/22 kits to fire arrows. Very cool weapons.

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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Guest on Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:10 am

    gone


    Last edited by Gui on Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:30 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Adding additional question)
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    Todd the archer
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Todd the archer on Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:11 am

    Yeah that is the one Gui, however it is 120 pounds draw compared to the Barnett's 150 pounds. Also see it does not use bolts to assemble.



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    hullutiedemies
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by hullutiedemies on Sun Aug 19, 2012 8:43 am

    Been there

    done that


    Assembles in couple seconds into this


    With long arms this type set up allows power strokes up to 3/4 of string length.
    And compound transmission makes it possible to use of very stiff short thick limbs. Making very compact designs possible.

    Or if you plan to survive in place with some available rubbish around, you don't need to even carry one in your backpack.
    Because you can make one

    quicker than you can say "Don't you just love it when a plan comes together."biggy
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    kenh
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by kenh on Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:48 am

    Interesting, Nerd. Crude but interesting. I'd like to see one done perhaps with dimensional lumber and decent cords rather than sticks hacked from the woods and binder twine Rolling Eyes

    What sort of dimensions have you been working with? Draw weight?

    Any estimate of draw weight with say a 10" wide bow? Looking for 'compact, you understand...
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    Kale Schlegel
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    Re: Compact survival crossbow or C.S.C.

    Post by Kale Schlegel on Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:24 pm

    I'm going to close this topic for the moment, as I've got to set my mind on one project at a time. Gotta finish one thing before starting another! hah closed Back to designing the trigger mech! sander

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