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    "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

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    "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Fri Oct 26, 2012 2:57 pm

    Hey Everyone,

    With the Halloween knocking on our doors ...




    ...I thought I'd go with the spirit and build something dark and unique to bring to the table. Luckily, I stumbled upon some very inspiring art by a young Australian artist - Rene' Campbell.





    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Ren%C3%A9-Campbell-Art/238074786252637

    ...with pieces like these rolling around in my head...







    I did a few sketches of my own...(no camera today...so just a quick MS-Paint sketchup)


    Going to be a nice build with a trigger similar to AboMickey's Pistol-x-bow trigger (love that one Very Happy) and the shimmed prod as was seen in Todd the Archer's builds.

    I will be posting some build-along progress photos once my camera charges up a bit. And as promised (if all goes well) a quick video of it in action from the party shoot.

    See you all soon.

    Ivo


    Last edited by Ivo on Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:52 am; edited 1 time in total




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Todd the archer on Sat Oct 27, 2012 2:59 am

    I like the profile, although I might tweak the butt a little to fit the shoulder better. What do you have in mind for a prod? Might want to get with Actionbows and see if he could build one for it.



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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:05 am

    Thanks Todd,

    The butt is solid! (isn't that a great way to put it? Laughing) But really...I was a bit worried about that bit myself, but now with it cut in wood...it similar in dimensions to a hammer handle and seems pretty sturdy. Dropped it right on the floor from about 6' straight on it and it just bounced up like a champ. And as for comfort, it's off set just right and the stock to shoulder contact point is just broad enough *surprisingly* to feel comfortable when shouldered...experiment was a success after all!

    Check out the progress, here's what I got down last night.



    And there it is next to that lil bull-puppy I'm also working on, gotta update that build too by the way. Very Happy



    What do you have in mind for a prod? Might want to get with Actionbows and see if he could build one for it.

    I was actually very glad to see Actionbow offer building custom prods, definitely will give him a buzz about that...spread the word through the main channels and all. Smile But for this build...it's gotta be a quicky (I'm actually building another one identical to it alongside), so I'll be shimming those generic fiberglass prods in there.

    Alright, off to work...be back with some more progress later.

    Ivo




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Todd the archer on Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:54 am

    Awesome, love the lines. What kind of wood are you using? Guessing red oak for the bullpup and maybe maple for the other. If you don't mind me asking how much time does it take to get them to that stage?



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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by jeep on Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:52 pm

    Handsome work!!! But I wonder to know why so many bowyers put sighting telescope, regardless the crossbow power or speed, and the fact that most of the shooting are made around 30/40 yards ? Red or green dot would not be better and enough ? I suggest a radar or maybe a heat camera it would be fun and fashionable...

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by MRobin on Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:58 pm

    Love the wood work..
    Great shape.
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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by riverwindflutes on Sat Oct 27, 2012 6:12 pm

    Thats a wicked looking stock bro !!!!!
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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by kenh on Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:01 am

    Heat camera won't work to detect zombies...
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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:42 pm

    reporting to you live from New Jersey... Where hurcane Sandy ripped off my neghbors gutter and blew every transformer in the state leaving us without power. Oh good lord...how will we survive this horrible disaster? Smile))

    Good thing I bough plenty og beer and ice for the cooler and stocked up for the bbq I was gona have at the halloween party...because that's all I'll be needing in this powerless wonderland. Smile

    Ivo OUT.

    *This message is brought to you with the help a potato powere cup phone*




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Basilisk120 on Wed Oct 31, 2012 2:13 pm

    Glad to hear you survived the hurricane and did so properly stocked Very Happy



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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by riverwindflutes on Wed Oct 31, 2012 5:43 pm

    Sorry to hear you lost power Ivo, but at least you had your beer Ha Ha !!!, I'm in southern New Jersey and live in a flood prone area, but we got lucky this time especially since I had sump pumps running during the entire storm and believe it or not we didnt lose any power which is a miracle in itself, My heart goes out to all of those people who's homes and property were damaged, "WE WILL REBUILD", you can count on that !!!!!
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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:17 pm

    alright...so I got the power back. Twisted Evil



    ...and on with the good stuff!

    Todd the archer wrote:Awesome, love the lines. What kind of wood are you using? Guessing red
    oak for the bullpup and maybe maple for the other. If you don't mind me
    asking how much time does it take to get them to that stage?
    Thanks man, and that's just the half of it. ;)For the wood, you hit it dead on - maple it is and the little guy is red oak. With the work time...I usually *baby* the hell out of the process...so stressing since I'm very impatient, but thought I'd exercise it a bit in hopes of developing it...nope, doesn't work, so I'm back to raging through it ....*don't look me in the eyes* type of deal.

    Drilled a bunch of holes with different size hole saw bits where the curves are (and there are alot, so the blank looked like swiss cheese) then cut it out with my little saber saw and got the my RAGE TOOL out made by Microplane in the USA . Think you're gonna like this one, as it saves a lot of roughing out time (leaving a smooth surface...NO LIE!!!) and just over all a pleasure to work with (like a giant Dremel ) >>> Rotary Shaper Drill Attachment

    Comes in two sizes..1" and 2".



    I got the bigger 2" one, so I only roughed out to what you saw before (and that's before I touched it with sanding rods/blocks ) - took me about an hour from the board...*don't look me in the eyes* .. Razz

    But yeh, really a BAD ASS tool...the blades are photo-etched making sharp as hell, cutting smooth as ever and I just *love that it never clogs up...no lie either*...and not all that expensive for what it can do. I rarely recommend things, but this one - GRAB IT LIKE IT'S GOING OUT OF STYLE MY FRIENDS!!  Very Happy Very Happy:D



    Now Todd, I got a question for you.

    I roughly cut in the prod last night and decided to stop right there for now...



    Since I'm shamelessly copying off of you, might as well do it right. Smile

    How did you do it on your kits? The prod has a *v* shaped bottom at the center, did you angle the floor of the prod socket to contour the prod or did you just do it straight down 90° with a chisel?


    Jeep wrote:Handsome work!!! But I wonder to know why so many bowyers put sighting
    telescope, regardless the crossbow power or speed, and the fact that
    most of the shooting are made around 30/40 yards ? Red or green dot
    would not be better and enough ?  I suggest a radar or maybe a heat
    camera it would be fun and fashionable...
    Jeep my man!

    I suggest a radar or maybe a heat
    camera it would be fun and fashionable...
    ...I WOULD!  Razz Razz:P..put a Thermal Scope on a bow, as well as lasers and a disco ball...*just as soon as I win the lottery*  Crying or Very sad

    ...but really, I do agree with you...only reason why I have a scope on it is because the red dots I have don't fit the rail I use and the iron sights I like are above my budget (and I don't really like red dots to begin with), so for now - scope it is for that little bow.

    ...however, with this new bow, I'm thinking of keeping it light. I'll be building my own little sights right along side the trigger. Very Happy


    Alright guys, that's all I got time for since I'm at work, but I'll be stopping by again tonight as I start on the trigger mech. jobbie.

    Thanks for all the comments, really want to make something nice and not disappoint, so any and all ideas are welcome...I'm just free-styling this build and don't know what will become of it, just know it's gonna be awesome whichever way it turns.

    Ivo, signing out.


    Last edited by Ivo on Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:45 am; edited 1 time in total




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Todd the archer on Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:41 am

    Ivo, for the prod motise I make it as tall as the prod. If made snug enough it should not rock. And front to back is made wide enough to accomadate the prod thickness plus the wedges, all square cuts. However you could make the height oversized to allow the use of different size prods and also you can add a "V" shaped filler block that you would slide in with the prod when installing. The cover plates will hide any ugliness as the slots in them only need to slightly larger than the prod (so the limbs do not cut into the plate when flexing).



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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by chaz on Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:51 am

    Ivo,

    Like the tip on the Microplane rotary shaper tools , after checking them out I found they are for lower speed use which is nice and like you said , do a pretty clean job. Found a set on Amazon 1&2" with replacement blades for $39.99. I have also been using an electric 1/4" die grinder ( the cheap one from harbor freight) however, that is higher speed and initially not as clean a job and requires a steady hand and attention as to what your doing as with all tools.

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:57 am

    Oi matys!

    Been gone a little while...*fella gots ta make a livin'*...but moving on, right?

    So here's what I got for ya on the updates.





    Yeh...wanted to go with Abo's bit, but then in the middle of the process got stupid creative again. Shortly after thought I was gonna throw this whole thing in the trash and start over. Nearly drove me nuts....locking up, not reloading, you name it. Luckily was able to pull it off after a few nights sleeping on it and trying to level with this thing. ~ "Oh, so you want to build a cool trigger?.....Let me sing you the song of my people."

    Did a quick little sim for you all on how it works...*looks easy...that's what I thought when I emulated it on a comp the first time...trust me - it's a deceptively difficult mech to make*



    Anyhow, I haven't popped it into the stock yet, but the plan was to make a trigger that feels like this one toy I had as a kid...Maybe some of you remember this disk shooting gun thing...

    In other words, the idea was to make a trigger that would gradually build up resistance as you pulled it, so every shot you wouldn't just feel trigger travel smoothly and then *snap* the bow goes off, but rather feel force build up as if compressing a spring and only at the peek it would bring things to life.

    Just got this weird feeling that it could be fun...really feel to squeeze of a shot....not just stupid hard to pull trigger, but a comfy build of resistance as you pull it. cyclops
    ...going in a completely opposite direction here from the majority's love for a short, light, crisp trigger and making it feel like you're squeezing a pruning shear instead. Don't know, maybe it's just me...but that's the beauty - you build it the way *you* like it! tongue


    Todd, big thanks for the answer.

    I completely forgot about the filler block...but then again didn't have room for it either way. Mad...ended up twisting my arms out and doing this weird socket with a "v" bottom, prod slides in under 45 degree angle and then twists to fill the socket. Couldn't get a decent picture of it, but wouldn't really recommend doing it my way anyway (unless you like inventing a really shitty bicycle)...>>>Filler block sounds too legit to pass by.

    Chaz,

    Damn straight! I bought one of those drums a long time ago at a small hardware store...cost me almost $50...*yeh, just for the drum* Embarassed...but still think it was worth the money to date. Thing is just awesome.

    Takes a bit of getting used to, yes...but I just pop it into a power drill and go by hand. Cuts so fast and smooth...has stock making written all over it! drunken

    Gonna go grab some sleep now...my job is just killing me...starting to wish I joined military, that way I'd be losing sleep over something serious...not these damn dentures/implants/veneers/etc.

    Good night everyone, be back with some more stuff soon.

    Ivo




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Todd the archer on Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:24 am

    Making a good trigger is like a swiss watch. Everthing has to be just right and it works like a charm, a hair off and it don't work at all.

    Trigger pull you are describing sounds like a double action revolver. Might have to look into that.



    Keep chugging along can't wait to see it when all done!



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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:31 am

    Did a bit of carving in my spare time ~ combination of Exacto carving knife and Dremel.





    ...I really don't know where I'm going with this, but it seems to be working out. Main issue here is I'm no pro at carving and what I can picture in my head brutally clashes with reality of things...things like wood grain, awkwardly position anatomy that is a pain in the ass to carve, etc...leave me altering the design on the go. It's a fun ride, not without bumps, but the final result (the way I see it ) is damn worth the trouble.

    Trigger...I regret to say...is a piece of garbage now.

    I missed one very important detail when designing it...I ran the simulation one way and only player the release. Resetting it, however, wasn't always possible. The trigger hook contraption acted as a toggle mech and worked in the opposite direction, with the toggle bending in the opposite direction of the intended and simple didn't allow the sear to move far enough for the latch to reset.
    The few times I somehow managed to do a few test shots with it...mech cycled, tight, but it worked (...or so I thought). When I spanned the bow, I must have over powered the toggle and brought something out of balance - jamming the mech with the bowstring in the latch.

    ~ Possibly one the worst scenarios imaginable. pale

    Since pulling the trigger did nothing (sear wouldn't come off the latch), I couldn't think of any other way to unjam it, but by manually manipulating the sear from the outside....or in other words....jamming a little wrench I had lying around - right into the mech.

    Couldn't find the cocking rope to slowly let down the bow once unjammed, but it's 3am and I'm anxious to have a look inside the mech to see what went wrong (...this is when you know you should drop everything and run out of the shop, because further fiddling will probably leave you on the floor of your shop, bleeding out of your ears)...but, the red flag never went up.

    So...I wrapped the string in some towels (thinking to myself - can't just dryfire this thing Rolling Eyes) ...aaand jammed the wrench into the the mech.

    I heard the sweet snap - Wrench flew across the shop and broke a jar of pickles in the storage stand (...those were the good pickles too Crying or Very sad)...and in the process completely wrecked the the internal of the trigger + scuffed up the stock.



    Just another example of *stupid* to put in your *DON'T DO* List.

    In the end, I only looked at the trigger next morning since I spent the night cleaning up the broken glass/pickle mess. Toggle nonsense pushed aside and with the housing still in good shape, think I'll just go with a regular mech. Most of the parts are still good and I only need to make new axels and trigger/link bar.

    What else?..Oh, while I was thinking about the trigger, I thought I'd get some carving done and ended up slicing up my thumb and bleeding all over the shop. Now, all healed up, with alertness and more importantly *common sense* back on track...things are starting too look up again. Wink



    Good to be back,

    Ivo




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Todd the archer on Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:49 am

    Keep up the good work Ivo the stock is coming along great. Sorry to hear about your trigger woes, hope you get it sorted out.

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by kenh on Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:06 am

    Stock looks awesome! Don't we always bleed for our art? Sorry to hear about the trigger SNAFU. Life happens!
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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by mac on Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:15 am

    Ivo,

    I just looked at your simulation. Can you keep the toggle from passing through by just putting in a limiting stop?

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Gnome on Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:18 am

    That's some mighty fancy whittlin', son. I feel your pain, I finally started carving some grip texture into one of my favorite stocks recently- not nearly as ambitious as what you're doing here, but yeah, it's an art all in itself. Sorry about your thumb, really sorry you trashed your mech, and really, really sorry about the pickles.

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:02 pm

    Gents...Thanks on the complements.Glad you like. Very Happy

    As I mentioned earlier, good share of credit goes to Rene'...she draws some incredible stuff, employing a wicked anatomy mix that sparked the urge to carve me a "creepy".

    But like I said, I'm making stuff up as I go...kinda cool how this thing is evolving in my head. drunken

    You guys want in?

    I shared that last pic on FB a few days ago and a friend of mine brought it up while talking about custom carved electric guitar bodies...aaand my jaw dropped. You have to see for yourself.









    Pretty cool stuff, right? Look him up, the name is Grey Van Kuilenburg.

    But yeh...why I'm mentioning this guy...back to the evolution of the design...

    ...since I work from dusk till dawn (figurative speech ~ I actually don't leave the lab lately ) and won't have the chance to sit down with that stock again in a while, think it'll be fun to brain storm this thing together...what do you say?

    I've been thinking what to do with this area of the stock to carve something interesting into it (want to carve deep)...



    ...and thanks to this pic, I think I know what I'll be doing there. Wink



    ...or if you got a better suggestion ~ my ears are open...

    Like I said - it's gonna be a while till I get to working on this thing again. Surprised


    Ivo,

    I just looked at your simulation. Can you keep the toggle from passing through by just putting in a limiting stop?

    Mac

    Mac, the toggle doesn't go pass teh center line and lock out. The spring keeps it closed.

    I've been spinning it in my head for a while and I think what the issue was - the aluminum trigger bent a little when I was spanning the bow.

    Just a bad design there.

    In order to reset the sear, the toggle needed to fold, only I miscalculated and didn't leave enough room for play. Which resulted in toggle pulling on the thin aluminum extension and bending it...so when I would try to pull the trigger, it would only move the sear half way and sticking in that position.

    I think steel wouldn't work out any better (mild stuff is all I got), probably just last more shots before bending like the aluminum. Like I said...just a bad design.

    So, I'm gonna go to a simpler, but tested and proven trigger. Gotta stop with this crappy habit of stuffing my builds with stuff I can't handle *yet*. Smile

    Again, thanks for checking out the build guys.

    Happy Building!

    Ivo

    PS: A bit of workshop music?



    ...sounds best when blasting at 3AM...Laughing Laughing Laughing




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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by kenh on Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:12 am

    I think your additional carving design will work great. Will also help reduce mass out there, which could be a good thing.
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    Admin

    Posts : 1041
    Join date : 2009-11-25
    Age : 29
    Location : NJ, USA

    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by Ivo on Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:25 pm

    So yeh...I was kinda surfing the net and stumbled upon this site...awesome little community you guys have here. Smile)

    For those who know my story, I'm sure you will forgive my absence (been kinda tough)...and for those who don't ~ Let me introduce myself...I'm Ivo. yeh 

    ..and damn...Has it been a long ass Halloween in this topic or WHAT!? Laughing 

    Long story short...I've been around...broke, tired, hungry...you name it. But hey, finally fought my way out of the paper bag.


    Back to work..ey?

    So...tools of the trade.

    I gotta tell yo guys, I've never been more frustrated. Finding and testing out what works best on a budget and then some has been...pretty annoying to say the least. Anyhow...here is it...after burning wood and breaking a few dozen bits I had (you'd think the carbide burs that work for metal/ceramic would work for wood...nope)...it's this little sucker...an aggressive Agent #192



    ...it's actually sad that it took me so long to figure it out, but hey...here we are.

    One night's work right there. Smile




    And another night in the shop...




    Still rough cuts and lots of sanding to do (not to mention *cough* complete trigger rebuild), but a fella can dream, right? drunken

    *inverted colors ~ how this creepy crawler should look like once stained black*



    That's that for now...

    So...while I was gone...how is the site holding up? How's everyone doing?

    Ivo


    Last edited by Ivo on Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:26 pm; edited 1 time in total




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    ~ "I don't have any special talents. I'm only passionately curious."
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    African Archer
    Tinkerer

    If there is a will, there is a way.


    TinkererIf there is a will, there  is a way.

    Posts : 109
    Join date : 2012-07-25
    Age : 36
    Location : durban south africa

    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

    Post by African Archer on Wed Nov 13, 2013 1:07 pm

    Ivo, one word IMPRESSIVE.

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    Re: "Sanguinarian" ~ [Rene' Campbell inspired :) ]

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