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    New project nearly complete Pistola

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    shiloh
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    New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by shiloh on Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:31 am






    This is my interpretation of a flint-lock kind-of crossbow pistol.

    It is constructed from 3 layers, cherry core and dense curly maple outer sides. I made a lock nut from laminated cherry and walnut with a 1/4" steel sear insert. To go along with that a trigger/tickler, basically a tickler with a finger trigger, it has pretty good mech advantage. The grip butt/pummel is layer laminated cherry, maple, walnut, the grip has walnut diamond inlays, my inlay work still needs improvement though it is getting better. Embarassed

    The prod is my first attempt at making from steel,(was wanting it to look period), fire hardened though it still feels a little soft, 19", 15" ntn. I`ll make a string for it and give it a try, but I`m not expecting much. Is it even possible to make a descent spring from average cold rolled steel?
    In my area there is no one who does tempering work, the last spring shop left town yrs ago! In any case I have a pc of fiberglass flat stock with extremely good spring quality which will work in a pinch until I can get this one tempered or acquire a good steel prod.

    Other goodies all hand fashioned are, brass trigger cover plate, brass lock plate, and brass prod lock plates.

    Cheers

    ferdinand
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by ferdinand on Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:52 am

    I like it! Nice work! Are u planning to make a nice brass triggerguard in a flintlock style? that would really finnish it. If that were mine i'd give it a nice dark finnish to make it look old.

    About that prod, what i know is that u cannot make a prod out of ordinary cold rolled steel. To harden it propperly u need at least 0,6% Carbon content and cold rolled steel will be in the range of 0,2%-0,3%. Steel used for springs is in the 0.6 to 0.99% carbon content range. Above that is verry hard and breaks and below that is to soft. U can buy spring steel in bars in all sizes.

    I leave it to the expert bow makers to tell u the details, but not all steel can be made in to a spring.

    I made mine out of automotive leafspring(used). That is a great and cheap material but also has it's own risks and disadvantages like having to clean off a lot of rust, there is a hole in the middle of the blade wich gives it the risk of breaking, if u heat it to much u need to get it tempered again, etc, enough topics around on this forum for u to get info!

    Hope this helps u!

    kenh
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by kenh on Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:03 am

    Really, really nice work Shiloh! Especially the inlays. Exactly the kind of thing I'm working on. Mine currently is using a replace pistolbow prod off of Ebay.

    Todd the archer
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Todd the archer on Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:45 am

    Very nice work, question how do you cock those pistol crossbows without a stirrup?

    Todd

    chaz
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by chaz on Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:59 am

    Shilo,

    Over the top! The uses of the wood in the design and the wood choices are absolutely gorgeous ! Very creative ! Can't fault the inlays.

    Chaz

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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by ZigiMan on Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:11 am

    Really nice piece of work!

    shiloh
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by shiloh on Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:01 am

    Thanx guys, appreciate the kind words;

    chaz,
    inlaying by hand I`ve only been doing for a while, and I find it tricky but getting better. I do do inlay work on some of the snare drums I build, but I use a router and guide jigs to do that and with commercially avail inlays.

    Todd,
    that`s a great Q. not sure, maybe I`ll run a stirrup of sorts or a small cocking devise. I`ll cross that bridge when I have a functional prod hopefully in the 30-50lb range. I figure that`d be perfect for indoor shooting.

    ferdinand,
    Thanx, I have been playing around with some trigger shapes and designs, just haven`t settled any one that suits this bow yet, but yeh I`ll have a look at some old flint locks and see what inspires me.
    As far as the prod goes I kind of figured that, but wasn`t sure about the whole carbon thing. As I mentioned, I do have that FG blank I think it could yield the poundage I`m after.

    ZigiMan,
    Thanx, it was a fun project.

    Kenn,
    Got your Pm, thanx. Looking forward to seeing your project.

    Cheers,

    Gnome
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Gnome on Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:50 am

    Very nice work! Regarding a cocking device, if you are staying in a 30-50lb draw range, you may not need one. I'm still trying to come up with a clever and attractive cocking aid for my 100lb pistol, so far no luck! So I'm using a removable stirrup- essentially a piece of heavy wire bent to into stirrup shape with ends that hook around the prod, with some padding on them so they don't scratch anything up. Hardly elegant and I feel a bit silly bending over to cock such a small weapon, but it works!

    Again, nice craftsmanship. I thought that bow was a fiberglass pistol prod from the photos- I bet you could put one of those in there with little modification, if you aren't able to get a satisfactory steel prod made.

    Gnome

    shiloh
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by shiloh on Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:46 pm

    Gnome,
    I did have an idea for a cocking aid, if the nose on mine was longer, I`d drill through the stock forward of the prod and fasten a square or round steel rod through just enough to place the edge of your foot on, that way you`re not compromising the prod at all. I`m still thinking this issue over, I`ll come up with something. scratch

    As far as a prod goes for now, I`m going to try to tiller a prod from the F/G blank I have, though it`s bright orange, I`ll have to paint it and wrap it in leather or linen canvas.

    Ok, off to the shop and try this out, I`m impatient and want to shoot this thing. bounce

    Cheers

    panne
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by panne on Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:46 am

    @ todd~ i span my 75# pistol without a stirrup by turning it around and pushing it with the grip against the something. it might not be a good thing for some tillers without adding some reinforcement screws through the hand grip. i can also span it by pulling it against my lower abdomen, but i don't do it that way often since i'm a bit light in the backside and have shoulders that don't stay in place from HMS.

    if i had a stirrup i could span it with one hand. without a stirrup you do lose a bit of shooting pleasure. some people may also be able to span the lighter crossbows by simply grabbing it by the tiller behind the prod and pulling the string with the other at chest level. i'd recommend a trigger guard and safety to do it that way for obvious reasons.

    Gäst
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Gäst on Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:12 am

    very impressive job

    shiloh
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by shiloh on Wed Jan 16, 2013 5:20 pm

    stefantwotimes wrote:very impressive job

    Thanx, it`s still a work in progress.

    So last nite I went out to the shop and made a F/G prod with that 3/16" thick orange flat bar. Backed it with h/w linen canvas, and painted it black, fashioned pin nocks(because they`re quick and easy), mounted it, strung it, and made one shot, the string broke right at the end of the power stroke, it`s fast and way to heavy for this bow, I`m thinking close to 100lbs, not what I want. Anybody need a home made F/G pistol prod, 16", 15" ntn, pyramid profile no thickness taper, 15/16" at it`s widest??
    I also fitted a trigger return spring to ease the cocking procedure, works like a charm.

    Next task now is to try another F/G limb, this time 18" same profile but with thickness taper to tame it down a bit., Nothing like R&D to while the time away.

    I`ll post pics when it`s done and done.

    Cheers

    shiloh
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by shiloh on Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:49 am

    Here are some pics of the pistola complete. The new limb is from the flat F/G blank, this time 18", 17" ntn, thickness tapered from 7/32 to 3/32" this produced a manageable draw weight of 60lbs. I`m now able to cock it by placing the grip against my abdomen, pretty easy without a cocking aid.
    { I should add that this limb is also backed with h/w linen canvas, glued on with a liberal smear of Gorilla brand(brand plug Smile) super glue(cyanoacrylate), love this stuff. The linen is basically high quality painters canvas that my daughter uses, very strong and flexible.}

    Braced at 2", draw length of 5", shoots awesome, into 4" thick of cardboard, the 8" bolts goes 70% through at 12 paces(5/16" dowel shaft, 2-1/2" plastic flights, 100grn field tip).

    Also came up with a trigger guard that I`m happy with, (brass bits soldered together) In the one pic you can just see the return spring against the trigger, this was a must to get the nut to lock when cocking the string, without it, an extra set of hands was required to hold the trigger forward.

    All in all, I`m happy with this project. Great learning curve, what to do next! Any questions or suggestion are more than welcome.

    Cheers,
    Rick





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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Quinn.Joseph on Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:58 am

    Love it. The wood choice is excellent, with a smooth transition from the bridge into the sloping handle. Nice work on the brass accents as well; I'd love to see an embellishment on top of the bridge, maybe an "iron" sight?

    Euell
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Euell on Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:27 am

    Nice work. I'm starting on crossbow from plans I downloaded from Alchem, I'm doing 3 layers of oak, change the butt end, and will be doing some carving on it. When done I'll upload some pictures.

    Vince
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Vince on Fri Feb 27, 2015 12:01 pm

    Very nice project--looks great!  You should be proud.

    c sitas
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by c sitas on Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:45 pm

    Vince ; you have an eye for the selection of the wood and the out fitting hardware. Sadly, can't say there any many hopes for the prod, the way you describe it. I like to hand make black powder weapons. they are out fitted similarly. I admire your choice of wood  and the  way you  used the grain . It looks very ornate .I also used to build hot rods. A lot of them were all looks ,no go. You have an extremely well thought out piece here. I love IT!

    Xamllew
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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Xamllew on Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:23 pm

    Oh man, that curly maple looks great. Love the flintlock design and the lamination work going on in the pommel. Where did you get the f/g blank if you don't mind me asking?

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    Re: New project nearly complete Pistola

    Post by Hermit on Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:39 am

    Hi Zam,congrats on a really good job.That's the good news,the bad news is about the prod.There is no way that you can make a mild steel prod work,the prod has to be made from spring steel.There are fibreglass prods available,but I suspect you want to go with steel,and the only real option there,is to go with a suitable used spring,and shape it yourself.You will not be able to go with recurve at the ends,unless you are able to soften the steel, shape it and re-harden and temper,this requires skills and equipment most don't have.Should you choose to go with a used spring,the b
    .est way to cut and shape it is with an angle grinder and cutting disc,but take care not to overheat it while cutting and remove the temper.
                                                      Hermit.

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