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    Post by biou Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:15 am

    do you have some plans or pictures of the mecanism of a crannequin , please .
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    Post by kenh Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:14 pm

    See Chapter 31 of The Crossbow by Payne-Gallwey. It's online at The Trebuchet Store among other places.
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    Post by JMC Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:11 am

    .......Hello I have some information for you
    crannequin 1c1cc210
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    Post by Hotspur Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:42 am

    biou wrote:do you have some plans or pictures of the mecanism of a crannequin , please .

    This is a very impressive reproduction detailed here:

    https://thearbalistguild.forumotion.com/t938-ranequin-xvi-replica
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    Post by biou Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:25 pm

    oui , merci a vous ,le livre de sir
    gallwey , je l"ai mais je pars du principe , qu'il est preferable de compililer et ensuite affiner son choix et les techniques appropriees , de vous a moi , je butte sur la confection du pignon a 3 ou 4 dents ,comment m'y prendre car c'est difficile a realiser !aller courage a bientot les amis et merci encore . Biou.
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    Post by OverlyComplicatedGag Mon Mar 18, 2013 5:39 pm

    There's an Eastern European (I think Czech) site that has cranequins for sale for 350 Euro.

    I think it would be more fun to design your own and have it made at a machine shop, if you can't do it yourself. The price hurts, for sure.
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    Post by Rizzar Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:15 pm

    Poland, not Czech at matuls.pl .
    350€ for a cranequin is really cheap.
    Here in Europe (especially Germany and UK) most serious manufacturers start with prices at about 900€

    Building one on your own comes with many difficulties and costs for machining are not to be underestimated.
    The time factor is another thing, unless you have a lot of sparetime building a cranequin out of nothing supposed to be project for several months.

    For the 350€ there are some possible difficulties with its design (others experienced with older builds) that have to be modified to fit heavier crossbows and there is waiting time of a couple of months.
    I ordered a cranequin in the beginning end of january and my plan was to let everyone know about its quality and problems with a detailed report.

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    Post by OverlyComplicatedGag Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:15 am

    Okay.

    Myself, I wonder if designing one on CAD and having someone fabricate it might be cheaper. Of course, you'd have to worry about the materials.
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    Post by Geezer Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:29 am

    A couple of years ago, a customer ordered a Matuls cranequin. I didn't particularly like the way the rope-loop was attached, and upgraded that, but otherwise, it was very good quality work, well worth 350 Euros in my estimation. I don't know anybody in my area who would be capable of doing comparable quality work at a lesser price. Geezer.
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    Post by Rizzar Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:55 pm

    Yeah Geezer you are absolutely right, the rope loop attachment was something I heard horror stories about, too so this has to be replaced if they use the same design nowadays.
    Nothing I would personally worry about (as far as I heard), but someone who has not the possibility for metalworks could get into trouble with it.

    Generally it is not the CAD works, you need to make gear wheels fitting to a transition, make a ratchet bar, a housing and everything must be capable of the forces.
    This is a job for many hours of planning and construction.
    If you are lucky and have the opportunity to use decent machines (CNC Mill or watercutter) you are on a good basis.
    But the efford is still enomous. It is not making just one part but several working together including things that cannot be done by a machine.

    Any company providing a cranequin for lower prices is more than suspicious to me, everyone wants to get paid and compared to the efford (in hours) 350euros is an absolute minimum my opinion and a very good deal if everything works as intended.

    Greetings Rizzar
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    Post by kenh Tue Mar 19, 2013 1:11 pm

    It wouldn't be historical and it wouldn't go 'round and round, but a fella could adapt a 2" cargo ratchet to haul back a heavy prod string, I would think. Rolling Eyes Maybe something for the more modern style builders to consider mounting on their prods!
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    Post by biou Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:03 pm

    cheers cheers merci pour vos conseils et documents , j'ai cherche partout un engrenage : impossible a trouver (ça devient tres dur le bricolage!)qu'a cela ne tienne j'en ai realiser un a la lime , a priori ça va je pense l'assembler demain ou apres demain . je "chine" dans les vides greniers , et la recup' en generale afin de stoker la matiere premiere. je tenterai bientot de vous envoyer des photos .salutations a tous mes nouveaux amis!
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    Post by ferdinand Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:04 pm

    biou wrote: cheers cheers merci pour vos conseils et documents , j'ai cherche partout un engrenage : impossible a trouver (ça devient tres dur le bricolage!)qu'a cela ne tienne j'en ai realiser un a la lime , a priori ça va je pense l'assembler demain ou apres demain . je "chine" dans les vides greniers , et la recup' en generale afin de stoker la matiere premiere. je tenterai bientot de vous envoyer des photos .salutations a tous mes nouveaux amis!
    I have no idea what u are saying, sorry.
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    Post by Rizzar Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:44 am

    Hey Biou.

    I´d say you will get more information and reply when writing in English.

    Would be the same as if I suddenly begin writing in German.
    The Google Translator helps a bit with non common languages,
    but most of the time, especially with technical vocabulary, strange things appear.

    No matter if your English is not very extraordinary, you will get answers if there is a hint to the question.

    Concerning the cranequin measurements, as far as I know there are none available.
    If somebody builds one he is, due to its complexity, capable for planning an own build with own data.
    I was playing with the thought to build one ago and simulated measurements with simple CAD (up top complex real time gear simulation with Autocad nowadays)

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    Post by JMC Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:25 am

    crannequin 1313b210

    found to this forum: http://forum.arbalet.info/viewforum.php?f=1
    there is many information on crannequin
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    Post by biou Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:23 pm

    thank you my dear RIZZAR you are right , it's better to explain in english (sorry for my english !) so , my problem : i have big difficult to find "engrenages , pignons , and theeth wheels" and i try to do it myself , it is not very easy and not enough strong! thank you for all , thk u jmc for the design do you have an other for the main teeth wheel , please ? .By Biou.
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    Post by Rizzar Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:39 am

    You are welcome Biou, a lot easier to understand.

    I made some drawings of the mechanics some weeks ago, perhaps I can help you a bit.
    The problem is, that every detail depends on other parts.

    One example is the number of teeth that grip into the ratchet bar, with 3 teeth, the distance between notches in the ratchet bar is wider than with 4 teeth.
    Depending on the size of the teeth and the distance between the wheel center (closer means better transition) notches have to be deeper.

    The things above apply to the main wheel and the little drive gear, too.

    The notches (and the teeth) must be very precise, too, otherwise you will get into difficulties.

    What were your problems concerning strength?
    Were the parts not strong enough to operate proper, or was the transmission to weak to span the bow

    For the parts istself there is an easy answer, make them thicker, case harden them to reduce wear off.
    For the transmission, make the wheels with bigger diameter difference.

    Here is a simple construction pic of the main wheel (without pins and axle, they have to be inserted and soldered or whelded together).
    I didn´t give measurements because teeth/notch size depends on the "neighbours" but the wheel itself is about 90mm in diameter and 10mm in thickness.
    crannequin Zahnra10
    I did not make one myself, because I have a lack of time this year and other projects I prefer, but I wish you very good luck.

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    Post by Hotspur Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:06 am

    Good old Sir Ralph has one laid out on page 138, You may want to look at the other spanning mechanisms earlier in the book as well:
    http://www.crossbowbook.com/page_138.html

    The Arbalet site and the project by ‘GAV’ of the German Crossbow starting about page 5, is perhaps one of the more comprehensive discussions I have seen on the Cranequin. Although in Russian, with babble fish much can be gleaned:
    http://forum.arbalet.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8549&start=60

    The Viking Sword is always worth a look for inspiration:
    http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7457&highlight=gothic+crossbows
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    Post by biou Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:36 pm

    my dear HOTSPUR realy thank you for the files and documents you send to me ! it's very interesting .Now i have a lot of informations and i can carry on in good condition . THANK you very much .
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    Post by ferdinand Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:48 pm

    Biou,

    U might be able to get good gears from a bycicle shop or even better is an old gearbox from a motorcycle. Maybe at a scrapyard. Those gears are hard steel and the 'teeth' are tuned to fit eachother.
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    Post by drawknife Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:05 am

    I made one a few years ago but would not want to do it again, took ages. However, the gear mechanism came from an old hand cranked bench grinder (sometimes available on ebay), the body was a piece of 120 dia steel tube (the size necessary to fit the gears) with a 3mm wall thickness, the drawing bar was a piece of 30mm x 10 mm mild steel which was hand drilled and cut to give an equal spaced tooth rack and I made the three tooth gear from fabricated parts. I am good at metalwork (I taught it at school) but even so, it took a long time and a lot of care. Not for the feint hearted. It takes 30 turns of the handle to draw it back 5 1/2 inch. I can shoot 2 bolts whilst an archer is shooting 14 arrows.

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