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Crossbows - Everything about Building, Modding, and Using your Crossbow Gear

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» fix bolts
by chaz Yesterday at 2:27 pm

» Collotiere a Charavines crossbow
by stuckinthemud1 Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:00 pm

» New Build for 2020
by c sitas Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:47 pm

» how to Build a non Chinese repeating crossbow?
by c sitas Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:05 pm

» Fascinating reconstruction
by drawknife Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:54 am

» Cutting delrin straight by hand?
by drawknife Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:09 am

» Anyone make their own bolts?
by sydney1942 Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:03 pm

» Cocking via moving the bow.
by ora8i Fri Aug 28, 2020 2:03 pm

» Claw crossbow prototype
by Phil Abrahams Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:20 am

» Stirrups, how heavy? Design help needed
by stuckinthemud1 Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:24 pm

» ash lath and pin-lock crossbow
by stuckinthemud1 Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:31 pm

» Finish on lashings
by stuckinthemud1 Wed Aug 05, 2020 1:48 pm

» Look what the smith sent
by stuckinthemud1 Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:35 pm

» Covid 19 and crossbow builders
by kenh Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:22 am

» Crossbow accuracy
by Geezer Thu Jul 30, 2020 7:51 am

» How do you feel about miniature crossbows?
by El Zurdo Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:21 am

» Just finished my windlass crossbow!
by Dennis Greenaway Tue Jul 28, 2020 4:01 pm

» Sinew backed crossbow prod tillering. Update and questions.
by stuckinthemud1 Tue Jul 28, 2020 2:43 am

» snakeskin not birch bark on composite bows in medieval period
by Cornerstone Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:50 pm

» two axle mechanism makers/accurate plans?
by stuckinthemud1 Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:34 am

» Stonebow Buildalong
by banuvatt Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:00 pm

» How to Attach a PVC Prod to a Stock?
by banuvatt Tue Jun 02, 2020 8:22 am

» finally started my first composite bow
by stuckinthemud1 Fri May 29, 2020 12:40 am

» AMAZING MINI CROSSBOW code name KillCovid-19
by El Zurdo Thu May 21, 2020 3:14 am

» Draw length ash lath
by banuvatt Thu Apr 23, 2020 9:47 am


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    Post by stuckinthemud1 on Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:14 pm

    This link will take you to an article I stumbled over on the reconstruction of a crossbow from components found at ths possible location of the battle of Banockburn.   I'd really love the thoughts of you all.
    http://medieval.stormthecastle.com/the-bannockburn-crossbow.htm


    Thanks 
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    Post by Geezer on Tue Oct 06, 2020 8:47 pm

    Verrry Innnteresting: The battle of Bannockburn was @ 1314.  That's pretty early with the sort of crossbow the artisan turned out.  Steel bow?  Probably not.  Steel cable bowstring. No-no.  An interesting project, but I have my doubts about its authenticity.
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    Post by kenh on Wed Oct 07, 2020 5:32 am

    Yeah... Not so much.  As Geezer said, a steel prod would not have been a thing in early 14th century Scotland/England.  Neither would anything from Genoa -- neither Scotland nor England were politically 'happy' with the Italian City States  in that period.
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    Post by stuckinthemud1 on Wed Oct 07, 2020 11:10 am

    I don't think the builder was too knowledgeable about early crossbows and I agree that a yew or hornbow would be the case, neither of which would be likely to survive, the tiller certainly didn't,  but, I think this is the earliest cranker I have come across. Anyone know of another this early?
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    Post by drawknife on Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:29 am

    When you look at the string connection to the limb ends two things stick out.
    The rod holding the string is a very weak part which could break.
    The string fixing "rod" will pull the top of the limb downwards causing the string pressure on the track of the tiller to increase. The prod on a crossbow is angled upwards and the limbs are also curved upwards to allow the string to slide along the track with minimum friction.
    This is just one of the problems with this bow.
    Do you want me to carry on?
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    Post by stuckinthemud1 on Thu Oct 22, 2020 7:52 am

    Yes. Please. 
    The thing that piqued my curiosity is the date,  there are references to winched crossbows being manufactured in English Royal workshops since the 12th century at least, and, through the 11th, 12th and 13th centuries or more, England was the most advanced crossbow manufacturer in Europe, I just hadn't visualised winched battlefield crossbows looking like this, the nearest examples I was aware of being the 16th century Italian ones
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    Post by Jack Pine on Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:41 am

    kenh wrote:Yeah... Not so much.  As Geezer said, a steel prod would not have been a thing in early 14th century Scotland/England.  Neither would anything from Genoa -- neither Scotland nor England were politically 'happy' with the Italian City States  in that period.
    Steel from that era would indeed have been a possibility, the first mention of iron in "ancient" times is found in the book of Genesis, chapter 4, verse 22;
    "And Zillah, she also bare Tubalcain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron: and the sister of Tubalcain was Naamah."
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    Post by stuckinthemud1 on Thu Oct 22, 2020 10:39 am

    Steel in crossbow laths came a little later and took a while before the technology became reliable. Even so early steel bows were lashed on and I don't know of any where a through bolt was used.  Early 14th century I would expect a heavy crossbow to be a large horn composite lashed on to a fruit wood tiller.  The integral crank with self setting trigger in 1314 fries my mind a bit, especially compared to the relatively well known English windlass spanning method. Probably best not to mention the non fletched bolts with bodkin heads though!
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    Post by drawknife on Fri Oct 23, 2020 3:43 pm

    Sorry, but I cannot see how the collection of bits of scrap metal can result in a crossbow of this complexity.
    The string is lower than the bolt at least half way up the track. The bolt would fly upwards on release and be unstable in flight without vanes of some sort. & per minute using a rack and pinion? I have a crossbow of 250 lbs draw with a cranequin and can shoot nearly 2 in 3 minutes.
    Is the trigger actuated by pressing down the top lever above the release mechanism?
    The prod is fixed to what looks like a piece of metal tube.
    How is this "tube" fixed to the stock, not with that long bolt I am sure.
    The stirrup looks similar to a more modern European style that could hook over a wall.
    Where did the metal track come from?
    Most European crossbows had composite prods and Linen strings, as at Poitiers or Cresy.
    The rack and pinion was mainly used in a cranequin but not in the stock until far later.
    Plus, the pieces of metal look similar to bits from old farming machinery
    To me, this is an engineers example of how to invent something from a pile of scrap.
    Sorry to be blunt
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    Post by stuckinthemud1 on Fri Oct 23, 2020 5:22 pm

    I agree that the metal, looks very un-rusted, especially where the author points out the small cog was completely corroded leaving only an impression in fhe soil.  With no archaeological context, a collection of modern materials is extremely likely but the rusted away cog as the remains of a cranequin makes some sense, you should go to the top of the class!

    Blunt is fine by me.  I would rather have a blunt answer than no answer.
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    Post by drawknife on Sat Oct 24, 2020 3:54 am

    Also, a Cranequin works on a gear reduction system giving an approximate 110 : 1 mechanical advantage. I can turn my cranequin, drawing a 250 lbs bow, with my little finger. The only advantage you would get with this rack and pinion is from the length of the crank handle, which is not very long. It would also want to rewind on its own if let go.
    From the description it sounds as though the rack is pushed forward by the string on release "giving a puff of smoke"??? That is a waste of energy. Can easily foul up and could be very dangerous.
    It just gets worse!!

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