The Arbalist Guild

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Crossbows - Everything about Building, Modding, and Using your Crossbow Gear

Latest topics

» 12th Century Chinese Crossbow Chronographed
by stuckinthemud1 Fri Nov 24, 2023 3:50 pm

» Crossbow Stock
by kenh Tue Oct 31, 2023 6:19 am

» Colletiere a Charavines continuing experiment
by stuckinthemud1 Sat Oct 07, 2023 5:36 am

» Cocking - how
by stuckinthemud1 Thu Aug 03, 2023 4:24 am

» Questions around heavy crossbow lath buildin
by stuckinthemud1 Wed Apr 26, 2023 1:10 am

» Arab Crossbow
by stuckinthemud1 Tue Apr 25, 2023 7:57 am

» prod angle, and lever trigger for sale anyone?
by stuckinthemud1 Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:54 am

» flexible string
by jasper1978 Mon Mar 20, 2023 1:25 am

» [solved]Skane/Lillohus crossbow thread
by stuckinthemud1 Sun Mar 19, 2023 7:44 am

» jens sensfelder
by jasper1978 Wed Mar 08, 2023 11:58 pm

» 400lb Windlass crossbow bolts weight and accuracy shooting high.
by stuckinthemud1 Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:53 pm

» Codex Löffelholz crossbow
by stuckinthemud1 Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:14 pm

» Digitar prodsc
by stuckinthemud1 Sun Jan 15, 2023 2:42 pm

» Troubleshooting
by Andy. Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:29 pm

» Wood Prods
by stuckinthemud1 Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:47 pm

» Colletiere a Charavines crossbow
by stuckinthemud1 Fri Dec 30, 2022 8:54 am

» Simplified Löffelhotz speedloader
by stuckinthemud1 Fri Dec 09, 2022 4:05 pm

» Fiberglass H-bows
by c sitas Sat Nov 12, 2022 8:44 am

» Bad Antler
by drawknife Sat Nov 12, 2022 3:48 am

» Anyone make their own bolts?
by Juniper Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:20 am

» Josef alm in English
by Juniper Sat Oct 15, 2022 4:22 am

» Qin/Han lock drawings
by kenh Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:16 pm

» stirrup dimensions?
by stuckinthemud1 Thu Sep 01, 2022 1:49 pm

» Skane/Lillohus lockbow information needed
by stuckinthemud1 Sun Aug 14, 2022 6:23 am

» need help contacting le musee Dauphinois Grenoble
by stuckinthemud1 Sat Aug 13, 2022 3:22 pm


3 posters

    Late medieval tournament distances?

    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:17 pm

    I found a mention in Payne Galway of typical guild members shooting oyster shells at 50 yds, but cannot find what tournament contestants would be expected to shoot.  In the darkest recesses of my mind, a 6 inch disk at 90 yds seems to ring a bell. Anyone know what 15th or 16th century tournament ranges/targets were,  other than the popinjay that is.
    tghsmith
    tghsmith
    Tinkerer

    If there is a will, there is a way.


    TinkererIf there is a will, there  is a way.


    Posts : 85
    Join date : 2010-12-14
    Location : raleigh nc

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by tghsmith Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:31 am

    A Deadly Art, refers to a contest in Nuremburg 1458,, target less than 6", range 300ft, 50 bolts per contestant (321 contestants) winner had 11 hits
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:57 am

    Oh, that's where I read it!  Imagine being able to hit a soccer ball in one goal while shooting the length of the pitch from the opposite goal, on a crossbow without sights, just using your thumb, or maybe the bolt clip, as a rear sight.
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:01 am

    Sorry, rewind, they could make bolts accurate enough to do that?!?!
    Geezer
    Geezer
    Master Crossbowyer
    Master Crossbowyer


    Posts : 1194
    Join date : 2010-01-12
    Age : 76
    Location : Austin, Texas, USA

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by Geezer Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:52 am

    100 yards is pushing the envelope pretty hard for medieval crossbows and bolts.  A friend has spent much of the last year shooting a medieval type bow daily at ranges @ 100 yards, and on some days get gets results comparable to the ones listed for the Nuremberg shoot.  The difficult part is seeing where the bolts are striking.  It's my impression medieval ranges often had a little hut with an observer near the target.... he used a pointer to indicate where the bolts were landing.  My buddy has a friend stand somewhere 'nearby' and talk him in on his phone.. modern conveniences.  He also has some bolts with lighted nocks for shooting in poor light. Geezer.
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:05 am

    Yes, I can see that would ne the case, I always struggled with archery at ranges over 25m for rhat very reason
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:28 pm

    Hi Geezer, I've been pondering the design of bolts for that kind of shooting, I'm guessing at a small point, barrelled shaft, vellum flights angled to induce spin, centre of gravity at or just ahead of bolt centre?
    Geezer
    Geezer
    Master Crossbowyer
    Master Crossbowyer


    Posts : 1194
    Join date : 2010-01-12
    Age : 76
    Location : Austin, Texas, USA

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by Geezer Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:33 pm

    Bolt center of gravity should be about 1/3 of the way back from the head.  Moving the cg too far back will probably result in instability.  Vellum vanes with a bit of spin should work fine.  Most of the medieval bolts I have seen were equipped with wooden or parchment vanes.  The wooden vanes are fairly long, about 10 to 15 centimeters.  Bolt lengths run anywhere from 30 to 50 centimeters, with the average around 34-38 cm.  It looks like high-quality target bolts were probably fletched with feathers, but of course the feathers have a very limited life in storage.  Bugs eat them.  Payne Gallwey shows some target bolts that were fluted over the back half (no feathers or vanes) ... sometimes spirally, sometimes straight.  If your points are small, those will fly nicely, with higher velocity.  Josef Alm's book suggests preferred material for war bolts was ash, possibly birchor oak... depending on what was available. Ash in particular was more resistant to breaking on striking armor.  For target bolts, you might want something lighter and more resilient.  Geezer.
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:29 pm

    Thankyou,  that's very useful.  Poplar or spruce might do the job.
    avatar
    stuckinthemud1
    Crossbow Junkie

    I live here!


    Crossbow JunkieI live here!


    Posts : 526
    Join date : 2014-02-05
    Age : 55
    Location : south wales valleys

    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by stuckinthemud1 Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:20 am

    Hi Geezer, I've been searching the internet and can only really find hunting and war bolts, do you have any images of period target bolts?

    Sponsored content


    Late medieval tournament distances? Empty Re: Late medieval tournament distances?

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:55 am